Hawks near deal with Hossa?
Posted by TimS on Wed, 07/01/2009 - 13:04
In a stunning development Wednesday morning, at least one source has confirmed the Hawks are in serious talks with free-agent winger Marian Hossa and may be close to signing him away from the Red Wings.
The deal could be for as many as 10 years with an average cap hit of $5 million.
A Hossa signing would mean the Hawks have parted ways with Martin Havlat.
Finding the money to pay Hossa also could mean GM Dale Tallon thinks he can trade goalie Cristobal Huet.
The 30-year-old Hossa had 40 goals and 71 points for Detroit last season, which is 11 more goals than Havlat.
If a player retires before their contract is up, doesn't the cap hit simply disappear? Since Hossa's contract (like all these very long term contracts) is very front-loaded, if I understand correctly, Hossa can retire before the age of 42 without leaving much money on the table, at which point the cap hit disappears. It wouldn't make much sense to use 5 million+ dollars of cap space on a 42 year old forward, but that is not likely to happen - Hossa is likely to retire before then.
Aren't these front-loaded long-term contracts essentially a way to circumvent the salary cap? If so, then I think the Hawks made a smart move. Either way, it's crystal clear that the new ownership is determined to win a cup, which is good to see. :)
the player still gets the money though in probably all cases. Again not sure on that.
2nd question: Yes, it's a way to lower the effective cap hit earlier in the deal. Franzen and Zetterberg did deals like Hossa just did. BTW, IMO the 'Hawks may attempt to do that this time next year with Campbell (if they don't trade him) in an effort to lower the hit. That'll help in signing the big 3.
I love this deal!!! TSN is stating that it is about a $5m cap hit which I would take any day for Hossa. This is Chicago, not Phoenix and if any franchise can support a super star it should be Chicago who support the hell out of this team. I want to watch Hossa score 40 goals in a Blackhawks uniform.
C'mon, wouldn't you take Hossa who is a proven goal scorer who stays healthy and plays both ways than an injury ridden Havlat who would probably have demanded a higher cap hit?
I hope they can move Huet and sign Habby for a 1 year while they get Niemi or Crawford with some solid NHL experience split time.
Dump Sammy, Marty and Huet and you free some space as well for a big banger to keep the goons off of Kane and Toews.
Hawks signed this center away from Detroit fro 2 years. Goodbye Pahlsson!
Havlat has nothing on this MASH superstar...check it out..google him
he played 77 and 79 games. It's before that it's dicey.
Kopecky is a tough centerman. Great work by Dale so far.
nice get,,,,very nice
You gotta think Scottie had a little something to do with this. Gotta love the Hawks getting stronger while weakening Detroit a little.
by signing Samuelsson too. I like his hustle but the 'Hawks are loaded on the right side.
maybe he can get huet traded
Oilers need a goalie.... just lost theirs
Havlat can still do a 1yr if my 2009-2010 arithmetic is correct.
first 7 years are heavily front loaded for 53 million last 5 years for 9.4 mill...so this isnt so bad...ref Darren dreger Tweet!
another 7 plus cap hit? wow
He wants out of Ottawa badly!!!! but when its edmonton he says well maybe i dont want out of Ottawa that bad! OUCH! LOL
Capgeek.com originally had a $5.0M a year cap hit, it now reads $5.2M a year, $62.4M total for 12 years...yikes.
FWIW, Matt Walker signed with the Bolts, 4 years for $6.8M.
What are the lines gonna look like next year? Who plays with Hossa and Toews? Most likely Kane. But wouldn't Buff look good in front of the net for those two?
This could end up being the biggest signing of the entire NHL offseason. Just hope Marty doesnt end up with the Wings!
hossa would have stayed for 4 mill TSN was saying,
he turned down 4 a year for 8 years from the Wings.
cross another poss huet deal ROTFLMAO
12 years......This is not what anyone expected the Hawks to do. I guess we all better become Hossa fans for about a decade.
Tallon must be hoping for a miracle here that the cap is going up over the next few years. Otherwise we are gonna have to get rid of some of our young talent. I hope some of these kids will be willing to take more of a hometown discount. But after spending big on Hossa and Campbell that won't be likely.
and getting worse, there's a decent chance it'll drop $1M-$2.5M for 2010-2011.
There has to be other movement so the 'Hawks have a chance to resign the big three after 2010 and Seabroook after 2011.
A Sopel buyout, Buff trade, Barker walk & Campbell extension to lower his cap hit IMO are all on the table.
I'd be shocked that Huet can be dealt even with a couple teams looking for a netminder. Who knows maybe the Oilers if they can't swing the heatley trade.
I wouldn't be surprised to see Versteeg qualified but not matched (to get the pick in return) and let go in light of Bolland's $3.375M a year hit.
I think you're on to something with Versteeg, and frankly I wouldn't be that sad to see him leave if someone signs him to a big offer sheet. Especially if it's a choice between him and Hossa. No brainer there.
I think people need to keep in mind that 5.2 is a VERY fair yearly cap hit for a player of Hossa's ilk. Very fair. This doesn't hamstring them in the slightest, even if the cap drops in future years.
a qualifying offer, hoping for either a small offer sheet somewhere else they can match, or a big one and getting the pick in return.
Kopecky also signed with the 'Hawks according to their site. He too was with the Wings last season.
Not sure why you think that ... Hossa's cap hit is going to be 5.2m/year. That's less than Havlat's cap hit was. He's not going to be a good value in year 12, but for the next few years (which is what I think you're talking about with the Hawks young RFAs) he actually saves them money from where they were last year.
Campbell was a poor signing. They were trying to make a splash and went for the name. Don't paint this with the same brush.
The cap has to go up or they will be in trouble. The cap is around 56 million this year and will most likely be about the same next year. Toews and Kane will both want about 5 million. That's being conservative. Keith will get at least 4.
So let's add this up:
Campbell 7.65 + Hossa 5.2 + Huet 5.5 + Toews 5 + Kane 5 + Keith 4 + Seabrook 3.5 + Buff 3 + Sopel 3 + Barker 2.5 + Ladd 1.75 + Bolland 3.2 =46.3 million
So they have 10 million for another defenseman, a back up goalie, and 6 forwards.
On second thought after adding this up it doesn't look too bad. But it all depends on the deals they can get with Toews, Kane, and Keith.
$47,913,041 for 16 players in 2009-2010. This includes the Bolland, Hossa and Kopecky signings (Plus Skille) but not Niemi since I'm not sure he'll be up here yet. I think Skille has a good chance if Versteeg and/or Brouwer don't come back. This also includes the $456k Brown buyout.
2010-11 will be interesting and they will have decisions on Ladd, Skille, Burish & Hjalmarsson as well as the big 3.
the money is ok...it is just his age (30) many stars have long deals , ovechkin, Frazen etc...cost of doing business.
Done deal according to TSN, 12yrs for 5.2mil a year. He will be 42 when his contract is up. Did the owner of the Islanders help write this contract?
You mean Mike Milbury?
For my new buddy Marian lol
How about keep Havlat and sign Hossa?
Tallon moves Barker and Huet and then signs Bulin to a one year deal?
Not a bad idea, actually, but they won't be able to sign them both. Of the two, as much as I loved Marty last year/in the playoffs, Hossa is a far better player. Excellent signing.
I'm really not sure if Hossa is that much better than Havlat when healthy. Marty was one of the best two-way forwards in the league last year. Marty will get close to this kind of money when he signs with LA later today. Hawks may have been outbid and had to punt.
Havlat has scored 30 goals one time in his NHL career. Hossa's done it seven times. And you can't exactly discount *when healthy* as if Marty's ONE healthy season means he's going to be like he was last year every year.
And also: Hossa is ALSO very good defensively. They're very similar players, actually, except Hossa scores a ton more.
If you put Havlat on that Detroit machine instead of Hossa he puts up the exact same numbers.
That's simply not true, and there's no evidence to even really corroborate that. The Hawks were also excellent offensively last year (264 goals to Detroit's 295).
Even so: what about the four times Hossa scored 30 on Ottawa? Or the two times he did it on terrible Atlanta teams (including a 43 goal season)? Do those not count either?
Facts people. Love them. Use them.
Hossa had 26 pp points last year and only 45 even strength points so yes he got a huge boost playing on one of the best power plays the NHL has ever seen.
Havlat had only 14 pp points making him one of the better players in the league at even strength with 63 even points. Put Havlat with that same cast of talent level as Detroit and Hawk fans are screaming how we could ever let one of the better offensive players in our history walk.
And also: you failed to address the fact that Hossa poured in 43 goals (12 more than Havlat's career high) while playing on an awful Atlanta team. I suppose that's because he had so many power play points as well?
A one-year Havlat deal is not out of the question. They have some 09-10 space, but not afterwards if they want a chance to re-sign Keith, Toews and Kane.
I'd be shocked if Havlat took a one-year deal. He's just had his first healthy season in five years. He's gotta strike while the iron is hot, which is the nature of the biz. I wish him well. Obviously I'd LOVE to see him back in Chicago but I'm not holding my breath.
He also played on Detroit's first power play unit, and Havlat was bounced between first and second all year, which means he had more opportunity. Also: are you trying to say the Hawks won't be surrounding him with offensive talent? Really??
Bottom line ... Marty is a very nice player, he was a great player for the Hawks last year (when he was finally healthy) but going forward there is absolutely no comparison.
"One of the better offensive players in our history" is a joke. The guy never even scored 30 goals for them! He's done it once his ENTIRE CAREER. Sure he's come close a few times, but so has Hossa in ADDITION to the seven times he's scored 30 or more goals.
Even putting things like numbers and facts aside: Hossa is a finisher. He'd compliment a guy like Kane MUCH better than Havlat could.
I said if Havlat was surrounded with elite players like Lidstrom, Rafalski, Zetterberg, Datsuyk, etc. he would have put up a 90 points easy and talk around the league would be that he was in the same class talent wise as Hossa. Lidstrom and Rafalski had over 100 assists as friggin D-men! Explain to me how the forwards playing with these guys don't benefit from this kind of talent in racking up points.
I really don't care what the guy did two years ago with Atlanta, but he was playing with Ilya Kovalchuk on the first line who isn't exactly Klye Calder. Go see Theo Flury and Doug Gilmour if you want to sign free agents based on a life time acheivement award for scoring.