The hit on Hossa
For the second time this season the Blackhawks watched one of their best players knocked out of a game by shot to the head.
Atlanta's Colby Armstrong laid out Marian Hossa early in the third period of Saturday's game at the United Center, sending the Hawks winger to the dressing room for the rest of the night.
Was it a clean hit or not? Armstrong led with his shoulder, which is fine, but he caught Hossa on the chin.
The point here isn't clean or dirty, however, it's how much longer Hawks general manager Stan Bowman is going to let his best players be targets?
Maybe this isn't a problem that can be solved this season with the March 3 trade deadline so close, but next year the Hawks darn well better have someone tough enough and nasty enough to show other teams they better not be going after Hossa, Jonathan Toews, Patrick Kane and Duncan Keith.
Ben Eager is not the answer and Adam Burish is more of an agitator than a deterrent.
Hawks coach Joel Quenneville didn't have a problem with Armstrong's hit, or at least he told reporters he wanted to see the replay before making a judgment.
I asked Quenneville after the game about the hits this season on Toews and now Hossa and if he was tired of seeing his stars get drilled or if the hits were simply part of the game.
Toews missed six games with a concussion from Willie Mitchell's head shot in October.
"I think you see it throughout the league,” Quenneville said. “That’s part of (Armstrong’s) game and I think you need to recognize it when you on the ice against (him). I think that we’re pretty effective as far as sticking up and being aware of those types of plays. The one thing I like about our group is how well we stick together and fight for one another.”
Kris Versteeg and Jordan Hendry were good teammates and came to Hossa’s aid, but that’s not enough.
Highly talented players usually get more attention from the defenses they play against, so it's no surprise that someone is there to hit them if they put their heads down. I thought the Hossa hit was clean, but the hit on Kane was borderline due to the guy having his knee in there. I don't like it when I see a guy who just threw a great hit have to drop the gloves because of it. Guys used to know how to take a clean hit.
As far as having an enforcer, he has to be able to play. Even if only in the slot on the powerplay. It is a complicated isssue, most posters have an opinion and make a good point. But with all respects to the guys who can't attend the game for whatever reason, you have to be there to see what an enforcers presence means. I can't count the times I have seen Eager and Burish go out of their way to backcheck & forecheck on the opposite side of the ice where a mean toughguy is playing. No way it's a coincidence, happens all the time. At least Burish will yap a little, as childish as it usually sounds. But Eager will be a complete gentleman out there. On tv, that's hard to see. When guys post that the hawks are soft, stuff like that bolsters their case. Detroit won without a heavyweight, so I can see both sides of the debate. But if you ask the players what they would prefer, I think they would want a sheriff to have their backs. I think you would see them be more willing to play a little bigger than than they do now.
So, enforcer necessary? Probably not. Would it help? I have to say yes. But where do you find a guy with soft hands made of stone with half a brain in his head? If you think you would be a good GM, answer that question. If you can, you are a better man than I am.
I seem to recall that not very long ago The Ducks bullied and beat down teams with a roster full of tough guys. I think that year they led the league in fighting majors and penalty minutes. And oh yeah, they won the Cup too. I'm not saying its the way to go but don't knock it.
And who would have thought all it took to quiet the goalie argument would be getting a few of our stars lined up. We all knew at some point teams would figure out how to even things up.
And as far as us being gritty enough in the playoffs last year thats last year. Eager is one hit from the dementia ward and the toughest guy on the team last year by far - Matt Walker is gone. Who knows how Burish is going to play. And we exchanged a 222lb D-man for a 185lb one who doesn't like to get hit. We may be fielding half a team of Icehogs in the playoffs at this rate.
Did Enrico Ciccone win us a Cup?
Warren Rychel?
"chicken" Stu Grimson?
Koci?
Probert for that matter?
Did it get the skilled players more space?
Did it?
Where did it get us?
Paul you OLD FOSSIL, you got it right!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Anyone coming across the line with their head down is a target.
The better players in this league didn't get there without toughness.
You can sight me Semenko for Gretsky, and I'll say he was able to play because he was tough too.
I don't want fighting to go away.
The game needs it because the unnatural act of skating along with a hold on a lethal weapon in your hand has to have some consequence.
I just don't see the hawks as missing an intimidator, in a sport where intimidation was a huge part of the game.
Brouwer's response was fine, and Kaner has learned the possum as well as any player looking for the ref to not hesitate on calling it a knee on knee MAJOR, not 2 or 4 minutes.
I like the Hawks pims where they are and refs not scanning the line-up for possible fight card events before games start.
If there is any use in Burish on a team that is far superior to his abilities (except for blogging), it will be as a retaliator.
You think there is a coincidence that Sopel is banged up and not in the line-up?
Might it be the Cap money is so tight and the injured are not on long term TR making it necessary until the playoff to play lower salaried guys?
I may be incorrect, but they are pretty close.
Dowell and Bickell, your 2010-11 Chicago Blackhawks...great to know they are gaining confidence, because all hands must be on deck as the playoff begins....
Finally. That was a nice response to the hit on Kane. Nothing dirty about the hit either, but if you are going to drop the bomb on one of our key guys, you need to be prepared to defend yourself. This guy got a fistful from Troy, loved to see that response.
Everyone always says the player who gets hit has to keep their head up, etc. True. But when you are dishing those hits, you better be ready to be challenged too. Troy's response was what I think a number of us have wanted to see all year in this situation.
Sure, it resulted in some PIM (thanks to the stupid instigator rule, etc.) but I would think the hawks would have no problem trying to kill penalties that were taken in defense of a teammate.
A fine msg was sent by old 22 today. Enough is enough.
Did you see Kane get knocked on his butt tonite? At least Brouwer has enough balls to stand up for his team. Any other takers on this team? I think not.
Name one.
you're dead on lieu! i've been saying that all year and been getting my arse kicked by the poindexters of the hockey world, you know ,those that want a team of 3stooges joe! "oouu,not so hard"!.
you definitely be looking for a weakness to exploit and if it is our perceived lack of toughness than so be it!
We proved how tough we are in the playoffs last year and besides one acquired hired gun will not prevent teams from running down Kane or Hossa...
The Russians always had this label but still played well vs Canada/US ..a good clean shot or cheap shot can happen anywhere regardless of how tough your team is!
Goons are absolutely necessary in the NHL. You can tell because Goons have such a huge impact in the playoffs.
This is a clunker of a blog post.
"Clean Hit"
All it takes is to change this designation from the NHL higher ups. I'm tired of reading about "clean hits". So what if it was legal up to this point, with what we know about concussions and how they will effect players lives long after they retire, perhaps this should be changed. Sure it's considered a clean hit on February 14th, 2010, but there is no reason to say it can't be considered a clean hit by the new season in October 2010. I mean give me a break, the guys that hit Toews and Hossa knew exactly what they were doing. Under the guise of it being a "clean hit" it was actually a "intent to injure" by "hopefully causing a concussion with a upward hit to the jaw line." Outlaw this and its macho undertones and don't make it a part of hockey anymore pure and simple. The NFL is finally catching on that concussions are a lifetime problem once you have them. It also might mean a $$$ problem if the players and the union starts looking for retribution.
He will make sure this doe not happen again!
The Hawks have not learned yet, but they will..........KEEP YOUR HEAD UP WHEN SKATING CROSS ICE!
Toews was laid out by his goalie not letting him know the PP was ending as Toews was looking over his shoulder to receive a pass. He had open ice in front of him but was not made aware of the PP ending an guy coming out of the box.
Hossa? Head down skating cross ice.
Sharp? Head down skating cross ice.
So tell me, how is a Tony Soprano going to stop this?
If he tries, he is bound by that stupid Pee Pee Dog Instigator Rule.
These type of hits will be reduced by 2 things.
1. KEEP YOUR HEAD UP.
2. Abolish the Bettman Pee Pee Dog Rule.
Ghandi
If you have a problem, if no one else can help, and if you can find them, maybe you can hire... The A-Team.
This maybe our only hope Cheese!!!
can you email at Boldirev@eastlink.ca please!!!
thanks
All in good time.
Remind me again at playoff time.
I will email you then.
George Peppard
It was for a matter we discussed here prev , that is better left off the board...
but i guess it can wait 2 months lol
Swiss, what about adding
3. Be willing to place that kind of hit on the other teams skliied players hard but legal.
The Hawks are not only getting hit they are not hitting. The game last night was a pathetic. Too many stick checks. Too many guys looking to run and gun. The reason the Hawks are giving up more goals is that they have forgotten to take the body when possible.
The Hawks will be out in the first round unless they start hitting.
Yes they need an enforcer. The only way the mid ice hits will stop is when they know their star players are going to get hit.
This is one I do not have an answer or an opinion.
If a guy is skating with his head down (anyone - a superstar or call up) and an opposing player has that split second to decide whether to drop the shoulder into him or not, will his decision be affected by:
A) The player's status?
B) The presence of a goon?
C) The likelihood the player will retaliate cleanly?
D) The likelihood the player will retaliate cheaply?
E) Making the right play, regardless?
Anyone who's actually played the game knows that the correct answer is (E). Those who have only watched will continue to watch slow-mo replays and bellow about the other options.
Madden's been put on the injured list and Dowell has been called up for the game today.
Hey Tim-you are a great hockey writer and your credentials speak for themselves. Following the Hawks wouldn't be the same without you. Sorry there are a few pinheads out there. Having said that I do think that the Hawks have the right idea-team toughness. It would be great to have a big guy that scares the other team a bit but its 2010 and if you want to compete for the Cup he better be a very good player also. Although if Hossa keeps scoring shorties maybe they can have a bigger guy like Buff drop the gloves more often. Plus it might wake him up if he's having one of his "slumber" games.
Hi I m from Slovakia and it was sick to see what that guy did to him, I mean there is nothing wrong since this is his career and job, injuries happens to everybody, but I checked some hits about this guy from youtube and obviously he got some problems with his shoulder which goes always for the head of the player. I hope Hossa will skip this game today and will play healthy for his homeland. I like to watch NHL and our guys since I m from small country and we have great players in the best hockey league in the world, but today I hate NHL for not stopping a bit earlier before olympic games it smells like money not sport, its only every 4 year damm it. Also if Zdeno Chara plays a D man in Hawks I m sure he will speak to guy with his big hands after that hit on his teammate.
Also there is one nice video from IIHF with what I think anyone can agree, nobody will miss this kind of "head check" people just can hurt badly.
http://www.iihf.com/home-of-hockey/news/videoconcussions.html
Sorry for my bad english, Regards good luck ! I hope Hossa stay in one team and win the cup with Hawks.
Being part Slovak I appreciate your sentiment.
Stan Mikita was a great inspiration for a kid like me in the 70's. It got me in to hockey and out of a lot trouble elsewhere.
For a little guy he sure knew how to take care of himself too.
Hockey has changed and smart teams no longer waste a roster spot on a goon. Also, whenever a d-man hits a player, he makes himself a defensive liability by taking himself out of the play. It's smarter to play position hockey and stay on your skates, a la Keith and Seabrook. Everyone needs to skate and have the necessary skills. Get with the times, Tim!
...then hockey is no longer hockey, it's ice dancing. I hope I never see the day.
Hossa had his head down in traffic trying something cute with the puck and he got drilled off of it. That's HOCKEY, the way it's supposed to be played. To accuse that Wild player of having done something wrong which he should be deterred from is just bush league. Exactly like the stupid old thing in baseball where a pitcher would be expected to drill the next batter after a home run.
Just last week I got dead-on flattened in a rec league game, a D found me cruising past his team's net with my head turned reaching for a loose puck and he drilled me away from it. My teammates simply helped me up and after my head cleared I told the guy, "Good play." Because that's what it was, a good HOCKEY play. As was the hit on Hossa last night, and the hit on Toews early this season, and plenty of big hits the Hawks have laid on this season and last. It's good hard clean NHL-caliber HOCKEY, period.
The Thrasher player did nothing wrong and the hit was clean no argument there. He should not be retaliated against either. By the same token you don't want your skilled players taking hits like that because you want them to have enough room on the ice as possible to make plays. If they have to hesitate for a second or two chances are they won't be as effective. The Hawks just have to be willing to hit back it's allowed. There is nothing wrong with putting a good clean hit on the skilled players of the opponents. Let them be the ones who hesitate that extra second. You have to make the other team understand that if you are willing hit our skilled players we are more than willing to drill yours clean and legal put hard. That's the way hockey is supposed to be played. There doesn't have to be a brawl every time a player gets clocked it's part of the game. You mentioned beanballs in baseball after a player hits a home run. I agree uncalled for. Pitchers police the game with the brushback pitch. If a pitcher comes in high and tight to a hitter especialy a good one usually the opposing pitcher will brushback one of their hitters and it's end of story. Same thing in hockey clean hard hit = clean hard hit.
Just curious Paul, if you had a chance to hit the player who nailed you with the same type of hard clean check would you do it?
Well of course I would, because when a player has his head down carrying the puck the best way to stop him is to knock him off it. That's simply good hockey.
As you put it well, "There is nothing wrong with putting a good clean hit on the skilled players of the opponents." In fact winning hockey particularly at the top levels _demands_ doing that, you ain't gonna stop the Kanes and Hossas et al unless you're willing to play the body. That basic fact hasn't changed since a little kid named Gordie Howe was playing pond hockey.
Things even out on the field...Hossa gets his hits into. Was not Dirty, things happen when guys are skating at 100 MPH and run into one another.
Last season Havlat even said that Kronwall's hit was a clean hit.
we know buddy,you got some good stories!! later.
timmy you're 100 % on, i am fuken pissed this am to see yet another 1 of our stars out, hey this nhl hockey , if you want no contact then either watch figure skating, at 10 grand a year for tickets, i'm not going to, season after season,watch rockford call ups because we have no one with a pair to stand up for their skilled players and also a coach with none either when asked about the same subject. you can't haveit both ways, you say the game has changed moving on from us fans that clamour for a probie or secord, that was 10 or 20 years ago right! well then tell the gm and his daddy that the detroit redwings of the 90's are long gone also. which they are trying to re-create. i, like the next fan,appreciate the skill, but god darn it enough is enough,this team has enough skill to be able to carry a situational player, and tim you're right, eager and burrish aren't it and will both probably be gone next year, seabrooke and buff have bb's betwem their legs when it comnes to knuclkles. team toughness my ass! now you have a star that not only will miss games for us,but will also miss getting a chance to compete for his country, clean or not,start answering back, here i'll tell you what, go to madison street on the west side walk from damen to central, hold up 10 large in your hand see how far you getmyou want protection right! we'll rocky and the fans deserve protection for their stars also!most gm's would agree,or the new nhl plain stinks!!
I know NOT bad ass enough, but when he was signed by Detroit, even one here moaned.
Guess a team fighting for the last playoff spot just doesn't feel they need a fighter...he certainly is not a lunch bucket scorer.
Oops, I meant obviously Thrashers player not Wild.
Wow Tim it seems you've done a 180 from a couple weeks ago. As I recall you chided us guys calling the hawks soft and said they had plenty of "team toughness". I've watched womens college teams with more team toughness. And to all these new posters having a sissy fit over your article - go watch european hockey and shut it. WE DO NOT have anyone who will hit someone after a clean hit like that. Our big guys play like thy are 180lbs. Love him or hate him if that happened to his teamate - Jackman would have found a way to pay the guy back.
>Burish continues to be missed
>Bourque was running Kane and other skilled Hawks during the Flames series last year and Burish took him out -- series over
>Burish also got in Iginala's head letting him know he would go with him anytime
>Didn't matter that Burish wasn't a heavyweight -- other teams know that Burish will extract retribution -- and go after the other teams' top players
>Would not waste a roster spot on a goon, but our bigger players need to be more "Burish-like" -- otherwise move one of them for a "Steve Ott" type
>In the last 22 games, there will be some teams with nothing to play for other than the opportunity to mess things up for the Hawks
>That means looking to make the highlight reel with hits like last night (clean or dirty)
If there is a 'new' NHL then Burish is what you do to replace the so called 'enforcer'.
All the items above are correct. We need guys.... actually - what you said is perfect - nothing more to say. Good post!
Well said Brother, people who really follow this team know that Burish fills his role as good as any other Hawk
i like him too, but he gets wupped silly every time he fights someone who can dance, all that does is fire up the other team.....see your other post reply, A. later!
I do not think the outcome of an individual fight is what fires up a team. It is the 'gameness' of the player and team. Burish is 'game' and not just the fists. It is clear on every shift that he intends to make every shift for the other teams 1st/2nd line miserable. I think that is a key missing element at the moment.
In reality I really have to question if that is even in Q's system. I think there are other guys that can play this role - but for some reason they just don't. I assume it is the system????
I wonder if you even watch Hockey. Did you ever play? Maybe read Ken Dryden's book? Thought not. It was a good hit. Would you prefer a Cam Jannsens on the team who tries to maim other players while contributing 0 points? Did you see the Hawks dismantle the thugs on the Flames in the playoffs and in this years series? Fluster the angry lesbians in Blue and Green in Vancouver?
The Hawks roll four good lines and most teams in the league cannot keep up. How about this, fix the power play as a deterrent.
Tim, you are a moron. If the Hawks get a tough guy, he better be faster and a better shot than Eager. Go cover the Bulls.
whats yours buddy? c leagues? park hockey, your back yard? tim's been covering this team for 25 years and probably forgot more than you'll know, state your case and move on. and yes i would like cam jannssens,colton orr,derek boogaard, anyone of the 3 on my team, we have enough skill to allow for that. ben eager is 1 hit away from having his brain turn to mush. it's a shame but he'll probably have to retire early like eric lindros and kieth primeau.
...for your cheap and stupid comment.
My guess is that Sassone has been the best hockey reporter in this city longer than you have been an anonymous meathead with an internet account.
I've been around enough to know he is not even near Bob Verdi and have been on Skates before the desktop computer. He should be embarrassed to bring back a long dead (gratefully) brand of hockey.
Hossa should have kept his head up. Bettman continues to ruin the league and the game. There are junior high school reporters in Minnesota that know more about hockey than Tim.
You are a moron, too.
So what...I owned a Vic 20 and skated before that....
Just hope you arent here for pleasant Hawk chat opportunities as that ship has already left the pier without you!!!
Gbubbs, I can't believe you said that. Tim is the best hockey writer in town. It's OK to disagree with him but he does not deserve to be called names. And what level did you make it to in hockey, High School or maybe a mens no check league?
probably neither, just driveway yard hockey with 1 net against a steel garage door and dads 4 door 1963 chevy biscayne in the way!
It takes a big man to sit behind your laptop and call people names. There are two other papers you can go read.
How man games has Eager played this year? He won't be back next year.
If you are Sassone, I apologize for insinuating you are stupid. I am sure you are a nice person. Moron should refer more to the general meatheadness of trading an asset for a goon. in addition, the goon not only costs us an asset(s), but wastes a spot on the roster that could be used by someone with a skill or two. Fraser and Burish can kill a penalty, play a decent regular shift and piss people off. Eager has speed to draw a penalty, has fought well this year, and can score a timely goal here and there. I would like to say the same about Kopecky, but . . .
As far as anonymous, the Daily Herald has my e-mail and Mr. Sassone can e-mail if he likes. I still think this is the argument of a moron. If my brother, dad, or wife said the same thing, I would call them the same. The Trib and Sun-times are just as bad. When you have to go to 670 to get any hockey info, it is a sad reflection on the town's coverage.
And lastly, as I won't be pissing you people off anymore, the fact that Eager has been available/used sparingly, proves my point. We now have 41 wins. To think think that people will stop trying to lay out our good players is just ridiculous.
Dude, what's with all the viciousness and name calling?
The guy is a respected writer of a column and a blog. If you don't like it and don't agree with it make a cogent argument to support your case. If you are unable to engage in honest discourse then go somewhere else.
Is calling someone "a moron" really necessary?
His credentials are posted. Where are yours?
i wasnt referring to your credentials...just the guy attacking Tim
read it again pls
But you do it all the time!!! but this time i agree with you...
Gbubbs, Tim S is the reason you can post your "views" here!
What is on your resume???
I 'drivel' but don't name call. I never called anyone a 'moron' or anything close to it.
Where I may have been critical of a persons actions (e.g. playing GM) I was not critical of them personally.
As for my resume, (if that was directed at me - couldn't tell) I have said many times, I am just like everyone else - a guy with a keyboard and opinion.